Pourquoi L'ALLEMAGNE n'a pas été DÉMANTELÉE à la fin de la première guerre mondiale ?????
Le 28 février 2023 à 11:59:28 :
Tu crois vraiment que l'envahir l'Allemagne en 1918 aurait une partie de plaisir ? On a gagner en se mettant à 3 contre eux avec l'aide des anglais et des américains. Les gens en 1918 étaient lessivé par des années de guerres et de boucherie
Premièrement: Apprends à écrire, confondre le participe passé et l'infinitif passé le collège c'est lamentable, sans parler des accords.
Ensuite sur le fond: Il n'y avait AUCUN EFFORT à fournir pour détruire les infrastructures militaires du pays à la fin de la guerre, c'est la demande des loges et des anglais à Clémenceau d'arrêter son avancée qui a permis à l'Allemagne de se relever en moins de 30 ans et de devenir la première puissance mondiale.
Le 28 février 2023 à 11:48:35 :
l'Allemagne a perdu la première guerre mondiale mais a accepté l'armistice. Pour démantelé l'Allemagne il aurait fallu l'envahir
Enfin un commentaire pertinent sur ce topic
Le 28 février 2023 à 12:03:33 :
Le 28 février 2023 à 11:55:31 :
Le 28 février 2023 à 11:51:52 :
Le 28 février 2023 à 11:39:21 instisia a écrit :
Napoléon a démantelé le SERG et 50 ans après tu as une Allemagne qui atomise la FranceGN GN démanteler, vraiment un forum de débiles
On ne va pas se mentir, quand on regarde l'histoire de près, les victoires allemandes sur la France relèvent de la grosse blague.
La Prusse de 1870 possède un avantage technologique certain sur le Second Empire qui avait une armée à la limite de l'obsolète et ne brillait pas du tout par sa capacité militaire.
L'Allemagne de 1940, quant à elle, doit sa victoire sur la Troisième République grâce à son innovation tactique (Blitzkrieg) mais surtout à l'incompétence crasse de l'État-major français qui était là encore obsolète.Si la France avait été dirigée par des gens un minimum compétents, l'Allemagne aurait beau avoir été démantelée trois cent fois, elle n'aurait rien fait.
1870 c'est vraiment le gachis , il y'a aucune bonne raison pour que cette guerre devait eclatée , la relation franco allemande post napoleon etait loin d'être mauvaise , la France est tombée dans le piege de Bismarck comme un bleu
Bah si. Les allemands qui récupèrent leur territoire que la France leur a volé. C'est la même raison que les français ont invoqué en 14...
l'Alsace n'etait pas le but premier de cette guerre , c'etait meme assez secondaire pour Bismarck , il fallait une guerre pour définitivement unir toute l'Allemagne (surtout les etats cathos du sud)
Le 28 février 2023 à 12:05:01 :
Le 28 février 2023 à 11:48:35 :
l'Allemagne a perdu la première guerre mondiale mais a accepté l'armistice. Pour démantelé l'Allemagne il aurait fallu l'envahirEnfin un commentaire pertinent sur ce topic
Bah c'est ce que j'avais évoqué
Ce qui a alimente le discours du H c'est avant tout l'incompréhension de leurs défaite, alors qu'aucun combat n'avait eu lieu sur leur sol .
Si on avait marché sur Berlin , nul doute que le sentiment patriotique allemand aurait été complètement annihiler
At the Teheran conference, Stalin talked first to dismembering Germany. and then said to Churchill and Roosevelt that they should kill 50 000 German officers. Churchill foud this abhorrent so Stalin played off as a joke. Roosevelt was all on board with Stalin. History wanted to believe that Stalin was joking. It was wrong. Morgenthau plan was a plan to genocide Germany after WW2. Henry Morgenthau as the US secretary of the Treasury and Harry Dexter White his assistant. This was accepted for a brief period. This was official US policy. The plan was leaked and it played a huge part in why Germany wanted to fight to the end. It's important to mention that both Morgenthau and Dexter White were jewish so you can imagine the field day Goebbels have with the information with 2 jews working at the highest level of American Finance wanted to genocide millions of Germans and crush the nation forever. To top it off, their plan was accepted as Allied policy. If the German ever needed a morale booster or a reason to fight, this was it. To to German people, it was as if the German government propaganda was true. To the world it came out after the war that Harry White was a literal spy for the Soviet Union. There were many questions about Morgenthau but he was too big to touch it. In fact Roosevelt was, during the entire course of the war, surrounded by Soviet spies. The United States had been infiltrated by communist double agents. On September 4th 1944, in a planning session for the upcoming Allied conference in Quebec, the 2 of them specifically referenced Marshall Stalin's list of 50 000 Germans who ought to be shot. For some reasons the drafting of post war plans for Germany was the treasury 's business when the Allied victory was appearing on the horizon.
After the success of the Normandy landing, the Treasury Department planning for post war Germany turned into a sick and twisted revenge fantasy. In the same meeting as the deaths quote discussion in reference to the Royal Industrial area in Germany, Morgenthau said the following : " Just strip it I don't care what happens to the population. I would take every mine, every meal, every factory and wreck it. Still call everything just close it down. I am for destroying it first and we still worry about the population second. Why would I worry about what happens to the German people. Morgenthau foudn there was talk of the state department drafting a much more lenient deal for post war Germany, demanding the rapid construction of their industrial base so they could partake in the economy again and rejoin the european economy. In term of reparations, it was suggested they last for no more than 10 years so that Germany could become democratic without the various issues that they fell into after the WW1. Morgenthau had to work into convincing Roosevelt that was the way to go. Morgenthua said : " We've got to be tough with Germany and I mean the German people, not just the nazis. We either have to castrate the German peopl either you've got to treat them in such a manner that they can't go on creating people who want to continue the way they have in the past. Roosevelt was enthusiastically on board with the idea and promised to try and convince Churchill in Quebec. Stimson, the proponent of the state department's plan never stood a chance with Rooesvelt. Morgenthau was deeply and was a huge donor to the democratic party. The plan pitched too Roosevelt went roughly as followed : First the mass murder of at least 50 000 German officers without a trial. The Ruhr, the industrial heartland of Germany was to be totally stripped of all its industry. All metallurgical, chemical and electrical industries inn Germany as a whole were to be removed.
Germany would be split up into several smaller states as well as a huge international zone which was effectively so the land could be milked for reparations for the various powers. This looted industry from Germany would go to the powers who had been invaded by the nazis presumably since at least 7 different known soviet agents had a hand in drafting this plan. THis meant presumably the Soviet Union and to top it off, Stalin was to be allowed to use the German people as slave labor. As he marched into Germany, he would be allowed to take as many German people as he wanted and simply employ them as slaves. When asked what would happen to the surplus population after the industry was taken, Morgenthau said that they would simply be dumped in the baron Wasteland of North Africa. Stimson invited Morgenthau and White for dinner. After this, Stimson being furious that his deal has been torpedoed, at dinner confronted Morgenthau with the fact that at least 30 millions of German would die if the plan was carried out. Mostly from starvation. They could simply not survive if their land was raped the way the plan was adjusting. Morgenthau and White objected that they didn't care. It seemed as it was part of the plan. Stimson claimed that the plan was totally against Christian values. And that it would bring chaos to psot war Europe. He felt that German people were hard working people and that was better to have them on side to help Europe rebuild after the war. morgenthau felt complained that Stimson was misguided by his silly christianity and that it didn't matter in his eyes if the Germans died. In his eyes,they were all guilty. He was on a sick sword for revenge. Next Morgenthau was invited in the Allied conference in Quebec to put his case before Churchill. He bought his side kick, the spy, White with him.
When Churchill heard of that, he exploded at Morgenthau but raising him endlessly about how sick and twisted this plan was. He also made the case for being totally against Christian values. The same way Stimson did, he claimed that the English people would never stand for such a thing. According to Morgenthau, couldn't bring himself to sign for humanitarian reasons yet was happy to firebomb German cities. Morgenthau simply said that unless Churchill signed all the Len Lee's Aid that was meant for the post war recovery of Britain would be withdrawn, every single penny unless of course he signed. This was no small amout in modern day money. It's 2 thirds of a trillion dollar. Churchill had no chooice so he signed. Churchill's closest confident, screamed at him, telling him that he can't do that, because it was against the values the 2 of them had spoken of so far. Churchill said that between his people and the German people, he is always going to choose his own people. However thankfully this story has a hero. Stimson leaked the plan to the press and dozen of others upon hearing this sick plan went berserk at Roosevelt. They couldn't believe that their coutnry had become this. This would be akin the greatest genocide in human history. A similar thread rung through all of these objections like Churchill and Stimson, anyone with an ounce of morality felt this was utterly anti christian.
In a way it appeared that Christ was intervening to save the German people. Faced with this onslaught and the prospect of this blowing up, in his face just before the election, he played dumb. He said to Stimson insanely that he had no idea how his signature had gone on such a document and a must have been misled when Stimson sowed him his own signature on the document. One of the main objectives was the Army at all levels due to the news reaching Germany about the plan, resistance had noticeably stiffened. The German people were not going to be pushed around slavery and starvation. They would fight until the last man. Now key members of the army went crazy at Morgenthau slamming him for convincing the enemy to fight while the army was trying to convince Germany that the war was over and that they should lay down their arms. American government quite literally created what German government propaganda wad telling. The faith in the Fuhrer became stronger after the plan was known in Germany. Eisenhower was also a big fan of the plan. But thankfully millions of innocent lives were spared. Although Stimson wouldn't act in a very christian way when it would come to the Japanese 1 year later, this action is worth noticing and too often, forgotten.
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- GolemOK
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- 28 février 2023 à 11:13:17
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